Paying your party's restock bills when using Dark Flow.

[Ade]

I just had a very smooth Penumbral Surge 6 run with 2 excellent HUcasts and a FOnewm. I was on RAcast (of course). (This thread is not about them; the restock bill at the end of the run is what gave me this idea.)

The HUcasts were using Dark Flow, so my incoming healing was minimal, as to be expected.

PS6 is a long, difficult quest. At the end of the run, I had 0 Monomates, 0 Dimates, 0 Trimates, and 7 Star Atomizers left. That is a very expensive restock bill.

If DF usage saved us maybe 30 seconds during the run, but I must now spend two minutes worth of time running Phantasmal World 3 Box to replace that lost money, then I'm at a net loss for time and money. This isn't fair to me.

(There are other ways to replace money, but PW3 Box is the MOST EFFICIENT way to do it.)

If we look at it in very cold and insensitive economic terms: I am having time and money stolen from me so that someone else gets to look cool / feel powerful. I do not feel this is fair.

If no balancing is going to be done around DF as far as its tendency to disrupt the needs / situations of others in the party, then we need to start normalizing the practice of DF users paying their fellow party members' restock bills.

Just as it's common courtesy to drop a Photon Drop on the floor for someone who spends a Halloween Cookie, this should be the same. So I'm going to start asking for this. Or rather, I encourage Hunters to PROACTIVELY offer this. It would be a lot more considerate than just continually sucking up all the glory and letting everyone else foot the bill.

Edit: And it's not like HUs should pay the entire bill. But some amount should be settled on for others having to put up with the increased strain on resources. Maybe 10k Meseta per run? Or 20k if it's a very long quest?

There have been absolutely zero checks and balances against this abusive and exploitative process from day one. I think Hunters have gotten too comfortable assuming everyone is just going to bend over backwards for them, and it's time to push back against this.

 

[cameron-]

hucasts are expected to pay for your mates because you can't avoid getting hit/taking damage?

anyways, i'll give you 40mil meseta on the spot for your expenses if you promise we never ever have to hear from you on this topic again

 

[Ade]

hucasts are expected to pay for your mates because you can't avoid getting hit/taking damage?

anyways, i'll give you 40mil meseta on the spot for your expenses if you promise we never ever have to hear from you on this topic again

There's a lot more to it than this, and you know it. You're being selectively disingenuous.

(For example, if we ran it several times then yes, I'd probably get hit less; to name one of many things.)

I'll bring up this topic as many times as I want. Thank you very much.

 

[cameron-]

so you dont want the cash? despite your post about requesting the cash? instructions r a little unclear

 

[Ade]

No. I want the dynamics around this item to change. And if it won't be changed from a developmental standpoint, then I want to see some positive change from a behavioral standpoint. Right now, one third of the game's players are being reinforced to believe they get to boss the other two thirds of players around without any counterbalance. I want to see that change.

Also, come on, dude. You're offering me money to shut up because you don't want this topic, or the status quo that goes along with it, to be disturbed.

I think a lot of players hide behind the dynamics of the HU meta as an excuse to be... unpleasant.

 

[XmusJaxon]

If we entertain your idea, I think it's a far more important discussion to pay back restock bills to all support FO's. The bill would be much less though.

 

[Ade]

@XmusJaxon Anytime after early game, FOs generally have an easier time making a profit than HUs and RAs; both of whom use the Charge special regularly.

So, while FOs struggle with Meseta in early game, they are usually the least Meseta-starved job the remaining, overwhelming majority of the game.

More ideas on my response to @cameron-

This isn't about never getting hit, by the way. Sure that would be great, but nobody is good enough to do that forever. This is about considering the NORMAL amount of resource consumption that a player might have to make during a typical run, and then acknowledging that there is a single piece of equipment in the game (DF) that, when used, basically mandates the party increases its consumables used- since healing is now off the table. This might be a slight increase in consumables used if the party has the quest memorized, but it might be a tremendous increase if the quest is still being learned.

(MAYBE the point of this is to get HUs to stop trying to DF during pub, non-memorized situations. Because it sucks for everyone else. Ever consider that?)

Because there's only one item in the game that does this (meaning: RAs and FOs don't get their own version of it), and because this is an imposition on others, and causes them to lose money (and therefore time), it's only fair that compensation is in order.

In most cases, the amount of time you'll spend replacing the lost resources will be greater than the time gained by playing without heals. (Assuming that a PW3 Box run takes about two minutes.)

Basically, if you're costing others time / money for your own benefit, you should probably make it up to them.

 

[Mome Chomsky]

If you talk to the lady at the quest counter she should give you some money that helps to cover the cost

 

[Ade]

Problem:

PSO is not a job

Your point?

You still have to maintain a steady supply of Meseta to play the game normally. And if you run out, you have to spend time farming Meseta, which takes away your ability to play the fun parts of the game.

Perhaps some rebalancing should be done around resource costs. Why is a Trimate 2000 Meseta, but a Moon Atomizer (which revives a dead party member at 50% HP during Free Field and 100% HP during a quest) only 500?

 

[Exodia]

 

[Sodaboy]

Stop telling people how to play.

“If you’re a broke boy, just say so.”

For real, though. You don’t need to cater to DF users and not using Resta. Just use it. Let them deplete their own HP again, if need be.

As said above, PSO isn’t a job. You don’t need to play “efficient” all the time. Just enjoy the damn game.

If you don’t wanna use Resta. That’s on you. If you can’t afford the bill for not using Resta, that’s on you. Go find another party to play with or you can ask them to use different equipment because you’re too poor to not cast your spell or because you’re too focused on efficiency and saving some seconds to clear a damn quest.

These types of posts are super discouraging to other players who are just simply trying to enjoy playing the game the way they want to without having to learn unneeded complicated etiquette when playing with others.