No Resta Grr - DF Users Grr - a neverending debate?

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kameikojirou said:
Is the force required to consent to DFing?
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No but it'd be polite to communicate & be realistic.
kameikojirou said:
Do you feel it is required knowledge for them to play a force
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Not to play a force no, but they might want to learn about it since it's a popular strategy.
kameikojirou said:
How are you going to treat them? Do you feel like this will benefit or hinder the growth of Ephinea in the long run?
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I don't feel like other players have a right to tell them how to play. I'm also a big fan of the "does this suck, or do I" test, so if I were to really want to DF, I'd just make note of that FO & try to play with those who appreciate it more, & more importantly I'd try to do well w/o the necessitated enabling (ESPECIALLY if it inconveniences others). I like Orotiagito but I'm not about to get butthurt if someone won't heal spam for me to use the special more often. Same logic for DF. I think making the most of the situation in the interests of fun & personal growth is better for ephinea in the long run.
 
Ade said:
It’s nice to see that 2020 thread in which one of my detractors said I’m one of only 2-3 people who care about this end up being extremely wrong. A LOT of people are talking about this now and finding their voice.

That’s yet another form of progression that the present-day detractors don’t see.
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I think you're heavily confusing engagement with care. People engaging with your thread =/= care about the topic in the way you do.
You definitely are one of the VERY FEW people that genuinely believe there needs to be some kind of social change or mechanics change to force players to play a certain way.

Most people are willing to just play the game.
 
Ade said:
It’s nice to see that 2020 thread in which one of my detractors said I’m one of only 2-3 people who care about this end up being extremely wrong. A LOT of people are talking about this now and finding their voice.

That’s yet another form of progression that the present-day detractors don’t see.
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This seems like a poor line of argumentation if your goal was to avoid making the thread personal & about yourself.
 
Just to be clear I like DFers, I think they are really impressive. Some of the most talented people I know use it very effectively. I'm definitely not throwing any shade at those that flow, and especially those that flow well! I've never said no to someone asking to flow. I don't care if they have talent for it or just learning. I have no issue with it. I'll do my best to accommodate it every-time within limits until it continuously negatively affects the party. While I have seen some bad actors, the majority have been swell stand up people.

The only point I'm trying to make is it's the Forces choice. This has always been the case since PGFs starting legitimately dropping on Ephinea. Even if no words are spoken. The force is making the decision to support it or not through action or inaction of using resta. They are the person who decides, due to game mechanics the buck ends with them. They already have the remote controller to the DF off-switch. You can convince them, plead with them, but it's pretty much still their decision. Wouldn't it be cool if we ask for permission since they are accommodating the DFer? Especially if they are new. If you want them to accommodate you and adjust their default role. I think that's what should happen. New players will go what's DFing? Veterans will know what they are in for! No reason to insult or grunt at each other... expectations are now set.

If anyone thinks it's not the Force's choice, we can test it. I'll bring my FOmarl w/ Tyrell's Parasol and/or a Resta Merge then we can discuss that particular point of contention further until we are satisfied on that common ground. I will say, we all already know the outcome. I'm not trolling, just showing the reality of the situation. But I think we all agree on that now.

I believe this is different from some of the examples being thrown around like shooting lizards in the face. This is the role's default behavior that is viewed beneficial in almost any situation vs accommodating a specific play-style that breaks the norm is being compared to the example where shooting "izzards" in the face is always undesirable no matter the situation regardless of equipment and/or play-style.
 
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I don't understand how this is seven pages. Original post is simply beating a dead horse. Administration isn't going to change the gameplay and the administration does not consider Resta griefing, even if said caster is doing it just to prevent you from effectively using Dark Flow.

Nobody is going to change their mind debating here. And nobody who needs to will actually take any of the lessons being given.

Exodia said:
Ephinea. Ephinea never changes.
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CTB said:
I don't understand how this is seven pages. Original post is simply beating a dead horse. Administration isn't going to change the gameplay and the administration does not consider Resta griefing, even if said caster is doing it just to prevent you from effectively using Dark Flow.

Nobody is going to change their mind debating here. And nobody who needs to will actually take any of the lessons being given.
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Ah yes, because any idea should be discussed once and stored in the vault forever. Is anyone forcing you to read this thread? Do we need to send out a search party to rescue you? Blink twice if you need rescuing! We can save you from whoever is doing that to you! :P
 
There was a lot of mention earlier of "what about the people playing RA", and I wanted to comment on this as someone who primarily plays force.

Monomates are the very first means of healing that the game presents to you. The second you create a character you have four monomates, and a monomate automatically on your pallet.

When I am playing force, I don't want to stop my gifoie stack to heal you. I don't want to stop my stunlock, or demons to heal you. I don't want to chase you to every corner so you can berserk spam, and zalure and jellen are always going to be used before I heal you.
Trimates are 2000 meseta at the shop. You can find armors worth more than this to sell, or sell a Photon Drop for 400,000 to 500,000 meseta in the discord/forums. (thats 200 - 250 trimates).

Heal yourself, and when I feel like it I might heal you as a treat. Just because there isnt someone using dark flow doesnt mean I am going to be your life support. And if you die, dark flow or not, I might dance on you before I use my moon atomizer. (because its funny)

Edit: its 3AM, apologies if i rambled.
 
Yeah it’s really obvious if you cast from the menu and then get knocked down. The game doesn’t cancel the cast it just buffers it until it can cast.

On a side note you used to be able to pk on Dreamcast with a quick targeting switch like this. If you cast grants, then quickly switched to resta or anti it would carryover the target and hit the player.
 
If we all at least try to apply all the suggestions of my original post... This thread is really overblown at this point, but most of the discussions here come from players downplaying said suggestions or actively refusing them, so i think, they still hold up.

Yes, i may have left out the 1/10 invuln trigger, which is useful to know for every class, but rarely ever used in public games. Maybe this changes now with more awareness.

Suggestions on how to "fix" the problem are interesting, but its almost certain that if something is done about it, its through addons. Is that Dropbox tracker guy still playing? He may have the skills to pull the resta range thing off... and why not add SDJZ while we are at it :lenny:

And dont get me started on all the "dead horse" replies. You are not helpful at all. It may be a topic discussed way too often for you, but not the majority of the playerbase. If you don't have anything productive to say, stay quiet in your ivory tower.
 
Thanatossa said:
If we all at least try to apply all the suggestions of my original post... This thread is really overblown at this point, but most of the discussions here come from players downplaying said suggestions or actively refusing them, so i think, they still hold up.

Yes, i may have left out the 1/10 invuln trigger, which is useful to know for every class, but rarely ever used in public games. Maybe this changes now with more awareness.

Suggestions on how to "fix" the problem are interesting, but its almost certain that if something is done about it, its through addons. Is that Dropbox tracker guy still playing? He may have the skills to pull the resta range thing off... and why not add SDJZ while we are at it :lenny:

And dont get me started on all the "dead horse" replies. You are not helpful at all. It may be a topic discussed way too often for you, but not the majority of the playerbase. If you don't have anything productive to say, stay quiet in your ivory tower.
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If you get to beat the dead horse then I get to talk all I want, not your forum.
 
I'm going to exaggerate this a little bit to get my point across. If you don't understand why this is a problem, you're the problem.

Force Newbie: Wow! I finally got to Ultimate I can't wait to support people in their games. I'm going to Resta people when they are low on health. Give them Shifta and Deband so all their stats are super high. Jellen and Zalure the enemies so they are more easily defeated, I'm going to have so much fun playing support!

DF Community in here: Slow down there bucko, If I'm in your game, you need to watch this Power Point on how you're allowed to play the game when I'm involved. Oh and I'm not going to ask you if it's cool or not. Just grunt at you two words NO RESTA.

Force Newbie: Oh.

DF Community in here: What? You didn't read all the pro strats on how to handle of us on the online forum guide. Guess we need to take your Force license away until you get your certification as a DF approved Force.

Force Newbie: I don't want to do that.

DF Community in here: Well, I'm going to insult you, tell you to "GIT GUD" and blacklist ya then. When will all these resta griefers realize they are ruining this community!
 
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I am sincerely doubtful that this is an issue for the large majority of the playerbase. This entire topic is always getting blown out of proportion by certain actors that want to enforce their vision and will upon others while accusing the other side of that very same thing. Projection much.

Let everyone play the way they want and adapt to it if it messes with whatever you prefer. Sometimes preferred playstyles clash and there may be conflict, that's literally one of the core traits of humanity. It's upon the parties involved to work out a peaceful way of dealing with the situation. If you are unwilling to do that then simply shut up. You're manufacturer of your own problem because you don't want to move out of your comfort zone.
Stop trying to bend others to play the way you want. That naturally goes for both sides.

Imagine communication.
 
CTB said:
If you get to beat the dead horse then I get to talk all I want, not your forum.
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You at least need to acknowledge that it’s not a dead horse. New perspectives and new ideas came to light in this most recent discussion. Cynicism in the face of that is disingenuous.
 
There have been no new perspectives. The perspectives are the exact same as they have always been. The one actual new "idea" was your attempt at forcing people to play your way via a mechanic they can toggle on and off.

This topic IS a dead horse, and Exodia pretty much hit the nail on the head for exactly what's happening here.
 
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